Monday Blues
Here are some exciting recaps of weekend events:
-Made lvl 57. Woot. (Nearly 58 now, actually)
-Soloed a 52 Elite Dragon in Burning Steppes, and made it look easy... while also being attacked by a scorpid.
-Got owned by a 60 warlock. Well, owned is an ambiguous term. Let's just say the jerk waited till I was at half health and in battle, then cast so much crap at me that by the time I got to him, I was a burning heap of bones.
-Got owned by a different 60 warlock and his pal, the lvl 60 priest, and their little buddy, the lvl 52 druid. Something I must note for you rogue strategists out there about warlocks. A few months ago, they modified warlock abilities and whatnot, and reset all warlock talents (as they're doing to hunters). This was months after I stopped playing my 60 warlock, and I haven't even allotted those talent points yet. So, there are some new little tricks that I don't know about warlocks that'll get you killed even quicker. Great. The thing that really got me was Curse of Exhaustion. Well, let me tell you the story from the beginning. It's rather funny, so please read. So, this weekend, I finally get the urge to check out Felwood. I run through it, mapping it out, and start on some quests. There's this quest to kill some Furlbog boss at the southern end of Felwood. He's not that tough, lvl 51-54? Anyway, so I'm wandering around looking for him, and I see these two lvl 60 dolts running around in circles, killing lower level furlbogs. And it looks as if they're taking on some heavy damage. I can't see why. I'm about to go try to gank the warlock, since he's at half health, but I notice he's got a felhound, which means he and his teammates have Paranoia. Bad for rogues. Now, I would have gone anyway if they were in the middle of combat, but at this point they were already resting. I decided to wait them out. (the 52 druid shows up later). So, they're doing their thing, and making their way to the boss I have to kill. They start resting just outside the boss range, and, of course, there are some furlbogs guarding the bossy. I sneak behind the boss and wait. My plan: wait till they aggro one of the guards, then CS the boss, kill him fast, take the quest loot, vanish, and make my way outta there! I've done this kinda thing before, and it's a great way to piss some opponents off.
I wait.. I wait... I wait. Finally they attack, I CS, take the boss out (one of the guards actually aggroed me instead of my quarry), and take the quest loot. By the time I've done this, the 60s are ON ME (probaby thinking WTF!?!?). I vanish before anyone can attack me, but OOH no... for SOME reason, a lvl 60 warlock can CURSE me in the 10 seconds my vanish is still ticking. Uh... WTF, Bliz? Not broken, my arse. (P.S. vanish is broke). Anyway, I always have a backup. I evade, sprint, and head away from my attackers. (I wasn't in the mood to fight a warlock and priest lvl 60 duo. no way I'd win with my gear. Attack priest? Warlock fries me. Attack warlock, priest heals warlock. Lose, lose). Well, so, I'm running. Now, I've run away from many opponents before. It's not at all cowardice for a rogue to run. It's a ROGUE. Of course every single friggin opponent has some SLOWDOWN skill. Quite annoying. I'm used to being frozen by mages, or crippled by hunters. But this? This was new. Suddenly it struck me, while I was "running" that my opponents were not only gaining on me, but beginning to PASS me! WTF??!? So, I take a second to look at whatever dots I had on me, and I see one I've never seen before (the aforementioned curse). I'm like... crap. So, of course, I'm dead before I know it. I stalked them again afterwards, but they had increased their party to... gee... 5 lvl 60s. Fighting lvl 51-54 furlbogs. WTF???
So, here's one of my many issues:
I believe that Bliz has actually nerfed rogues, but not by tweaking rogue skills. They did it by tweaking all the other classes' anti-rogue skills.
Everyone has the opportunity to see a rogue: catseye elixir, perception, detect hidden, paranoia, etc.
Everyone can slow a rogue down so the rogue can't melee or run away.
Ugh. Know what? I'm tired of writing this rant. Not like anyone's going to read it, let alone respond. But, if you are reading this, and you know of other anti-rogue tweaks, please add them in comments.
Oh, another issue: it seems that about 90% of the mobs have some sort of stun ability if you're running away. I believe this is on purpose so that Bliz can stop players from over-kiting. There have been earlier MMORPGs where a talented kiter could always stay out of melee range, and kill much higher level opponents with ease. This is also why Bliz implemented EVADE, so that you couldn't constantly kite a creature, or lead it endlessly or to guards or something like that. Just Bliz trying to be anti-exploitive.
-Made lvl 57. Woot. (Nearly 58 now, actually)
-Soloed a 52 Elite Dragon in Burning Steppes, and made it look easy... while also being attacked by a scorpid.
-Got owned by a 60 warlock. Well, owned is an ambiguous term. Let's just say the jerk waited till I was at half health and in battle, then cast so much crap at me that by the time I got to him, I was a burning heap of bones.
-Got owned by a different 60 warlock and his pal, the lvl 60 priest, and their little buddy, the lvl 52 druid. Something I must note for you rogue strategists out there about warlocks. A few months ago, they modified warlock abilities and whatnot, and reset all warlock talents (as they're doing to hunters). This was months after I stopped playing my 60 warlock, and I haven't even allotted those talent points yet. So, there are some new little tricks that I don't know about warlocks that'll get you killed even quicker. Great. The thing that really got me was Curse of Exhaustion. Well, let me tell you the story from the beginning. It's rather funny, so please read. So, this weekend, I finally get the urge to check out Felwood. I run through it, mapping it out, and start on some quests. There's this quest to kill some Furlbog boss at the southern end of Felwood. He's not that tough, lvl 51-54? Anyway, so I'm wandering around looking for him, and I see these two lvl 60 dolts running around in circles, killing lower level furlbogs. And it looks as if they're taking on some heavy damage. I can't see why. I'm about to go try to gank the warlock, since he's at half health, but I notice he's got a felhound, which means he and his teammates have Paranoia. Bad for rogues. Now, I would have gone anyway if they were in the middle of combat, but at this point they were already resting. I decided to wait them out. (the 52 druid shows up later). So, they're doing their thing, and making their way to the boss I have to kill. They start resting just outside the boss range, and, of course, there are some furlbogs guarding the bossy. I sneak behind the boss and wait. My plan: wait till they aggro one of the guards, then CS the boss, kill him fast, take the quest loot, vanish, and make my way outta there! I've done this kinda thing before, and it's a great way to piss some opponents off.
I wait.. I wait... I wait. Finally they attack, I CS, take the boss out (one of the guards actually aggroed me instead of my quarry), and take the quest loot. By the time I've done this, the 60s are ON ME (probaby thinking WTF!?!?). I vanish before anyone can attack me, but OOH no... for SOME reason, a lvl 60 warlock can CURSE me in the 10 seconds my vanish is still ticking. Uh... WTF, Bliz? Not broken, my arse. (P.S. vanish is broke). Anyway, I always have a backup. I evade, sprint, and head away from my attackers. (I wasn't in the mood to fight a warlock and priest lvl 60 duo. no way I'd win with my gear. Attack priest? Warlock fries me. Attack warlock, priest heals warlock. Lose, lose). Well, so, I'm running. Now, I've run away from many opponents before. It's not at all cowardice for a rogue to run. It's a ROGUE. Of course every single friggin opponent has some SLOWDOWN skill. Quite annoying. I'm used to being frozen by mages, or crippled by hunters. But this? This was new. Suddenly it struck me, while I was "running" that my opponents were not only gaining on me, but beginning to PASS me! WTF??!? So, I take a second to look at whatever dots I had on me, and I see one I've never seen before (the aforementioned curse). I'm like... crap. So, of course, I'm dead before I know it. I stalked them again afterwards, but they had increased their party to... gee... 5 lvl 60s. Fighting lvl 51-54 furlbogs. WTF???
So, here's one of my many issues:
I believe that Bliz has actually nerfed rogues, but not by tweaking rogue skills. They did it by tweaking all the other classes' anti-rogue skills.
Everyone has the opportunity to see a rogue: catseye elixir, perception, detect hidden, paranoia, etc.
Everyone can slow a rogue down so the rogue can't melee or run away.
Ugh. Know what? I'm tired of writing this rant. Not like anyone's going to read it, let alone respond. But, if you are reading this, and you know of other anti-rogue tweaks, please add them in comments.
Oh, another issue: it seems that about 90% of the mobs have some sort of stun ability if you're running away. I believe this is on purpose so that Bliz can stop players from over-kiting. There have been earlier MMORPGs where a talented kiter could always stay out of melee range, and kill much higher level opponents with ease. This is also why Bliz implemented EVADE, so that you couldn't constantly kite a creature, or lead it endlessly or to guards or something like that. Just Bliz trying to be anti-exploitive.
posted by Psyae at 8:26 AM
8 Comments:
I say kill more paladins, they have no way of slowing you. Tho, they could always pop their shield and hearth, but I say that is a moral victory for you (even if you don't get an HPs). I'm sorry Psyae, but I don't feel sorry for you, I hate rogues. I like playing with you, cuz you are my rogue equalizer. Mostly, cuz you are one. I do play on a PvP server, cuz I do like to kill other players, but they can always see me coming if they are looking. However, I've lost count of how many times I was ganked from behind by a rogue, just after I finished killing a tough mob, or several tough mobs. Being mostly dead and out of mana, my only choice is to die at that point. Oh, I try to run and blink and mana shield and pop my mana gem stone, but one good crit (uber easy for rogues to get) and I'm dead before I've taken 3 steps. So... I'm sorry that I can not sympathize with your plight. I call it rogue karma. Or, to use another cliche, what goes around comes around. Take your pick.
P.S. I'll still be logging on to finish Billtrollo and to do MC, but I'm going to explore CoH some. If your interested I'm playing on the Freedom server with one of two heroes, either Shadow's Siren or Deathripper. Both are scrappers, but they are pretty diferent in their builds. (Wow, this is a real long P.S.)
Heh, thanks for commenting. Well, not exactly looking for sympathy. Actually, I hate rogues, too. Which is exactly why I became one. I did play a warlock to lvl 60, you know, and that was such a pain. I might as well have been wearing a "STAB ME" sign.
As for CoH, I got very tired of the repetitive nature of the quests. Each one was virtually identical: go into X (sewer, back alley, building) and kill Y (some boss), and notice how similar everything is from the last 200 times you did this quest, but at varying levels. Similar to WoW, CoH is a race to the top levels so you can taste a modicum of end-game content, which in CoH does seem pretty cool, but, ah, gets old.
I dunno. Maybe I'll just retire from MMORPGing after I hit 60 and do a few instances (if I ever get a guild invite). I could probably do with a year of reading books, enhancing my lifestyle, etc. Anyway, Billy, send me yer email or something (you can email me by clicking my name in the blog somewhere, I believe), and we'll keep in touch.
While I haven't run into the problem yet - I will say that after reading more of the 1.7 patch notes - the feel is indeed that rogues are getting nerfed. Not by bliz taking away their abilities - but instead by making it easier for others to detect and deal with them.
Against mobs - this doesn't present much worry. Against other players - this makes things even harder. So - let me get this straight. We have less health, less armor, and our one real equalizer (subtelty) is potentially getting overpowered.
Other classes may be able to see rogues, but it is generally only for a very short time period. It's impossible to run around with perception on all the time...the cooldown is really long and the ability is really brief. So, while I may be able to spot a rogue every once in a while when I know they are around, I still get ganked by them all the time, especially when out questing or preoccupied by mobs. I say, nerf shaman.
Okay Theo - I'm getting the feeling that you're laughing at our plight! Bad move amigo ;) you gotsta go /afk sometime ;)
I love when a class starts complaining about what they don't have. Rogues get leather at least, I play a mage and I'm protected by tissue paper. And I wager I have less hit points than any rogue as well. Every class has its weaknesses. I used to play paladin and I got real tired of people telling me that I was invincible. Let me tell you, the only rogue I ever beat stood in front of me and tried to go toe to toe with me as a paladin. That is the single best things Paladins do, go toe to toe. No other class, not even warriors can really do that. However, every other rogue would run in circles around me and wear me down and make me pop all my timers and I would still lose (I never once popped my shield and hearthed). And I have 7000+ armor as a level 60 Paladin. So, please don't complain about wearing leather. Rogues are all about DPS, unleash as much damage as possible, only mages do more damage (and that usually in groups). So, they couldn't do that much damage and have the armor of a warrior or paladin, or even a shaman for that matter. I agree with Cordy's opinion, that sure other classes have ways of detecting rogues, but that means we have to be looking for you to begin with. Stop complaining and do what rogues do best, sneak in when you are not being thought of and kill, then vanish and run away to some other unsupecting prey.
Hey, I'm starting to see your point about CoH. I was intrigued at first by all the choices in character creation. Took me back to the days when I used to play champions, and it was good. However, I'm now level 11 and all the missions are the same, some of the place names and boss names are different, but other than that I'm killing the same mobs over and over. Just a little tougher each time. It is a crying shame, to have that many options while creating your character, only to be rewarded with boring uninspired game play. Oh well...
Yeah, for character creation, CoH has no equal. But that's about as good as it gets. I mean, flying is fun as hell, and some of the powers are neat, but once you've flown to the artificial ceiling a dozen times in all the (what 6?) maps, it gets old quick.
Well, to address your slander of my "complaining" (:)), I just have to say that we're all right in some ways. I think it's situational. For the most part, anyone ganked while fighting mobs is at a great disadvantage. If rogues don't get a good opening, it evens the fight out a lot. I guess what I posted much earlier is probably closest to correct: better players do better in fights. I've fought plenty of players of higher level and won, and I've fought a good number of players of lower level and lost miserably. They were just better.
Long story short: come back to WoW, Billy. ;)
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